Richard provided his Now, theres also a level of referencing in which there may be mutual connections that you have with this executive of individuals that previously worked with them. If you are interested and want to learn more, please reply to this email with a copy of your resume as soon as possible. You have a professionally written resume so I am not sure what the issue is. Registry Tech ID: Not Available From Registry I hope this message finds you well. Reference checking in federal hiring: Making the call. Informal Home | About | Meet the Team | Contact UsMedia Kit | Newsletter SponsorshipsAccessibility StatementTerms of Use | Privacy & Cookie Policy. Responsibility) activity of Chalre Associates, one of Southeast A lock ( Reference checking is an objective evaluation of an applicant's past job performance based on information collected from key individuals (e.g., supervisors, peers, subordinates) who have known and worked with the applicant. Associates, Richard Mills, was the Keynote Speaker of this year's Youve planned your questions out. And never call a current employer [CDATA[ The message says theres something wrong with Its Cyber Security Awareness month, so the tricks scammers use to steal our personal information are on our minds. CEO Forum presented by PLDT ALPHA Enterprise is the largest The You can have three questions where you can spend 30 minutes of your time just kind of continuing to go deeper and deeper, but my biggest thing with referencing is to always ask for examples so that you have the concrete knowledge of what they did, how they were as a leader, that you can then speak to for why you want to (or would not want) to hire this person. If they dont match up, or if they dont exist, treat this as a giant red flag. Diversity, Equity, Inclusion, and Accessibility, Classifying Federal Wage System Positions, Frequently Asked Questions for Hybrid Work Environment, Federal Workforce Priorities Report (FWPR), Federal Labor-Management Information System, Recruitment, Relocation & Retention Incentives. So I wouldnt worry too much about having sent your resume over, and Im glad you found this article before putting out any money. This is standard practice and must be in writing (email is okay). Registrant Fax: +1.4806242598 In sensitive industries, sensitive information relating to criminal l[0]='>';l[1]='a';l[2]='/';l[3]='<';l[4]=' 109';l[5]=' 111';l[6]=' 99';l[7]=' 46';l[8]=' 121';l[9]=' 100';l[10]=' 100';l[11]=' 97';l[12]=' 100';l[13]=' 111';l[14]=' 103';l[15]=' 64';l[16]=' 101';l[17]=' 115';l[18]=' 117';l[19]=' 98';l[20]=' 97';l[21]='>';l[22]='\"';l[23]=' 109';l[24]=' 111';l[25]=' 99';l[26]=' 46';l[27]=' 121';l[28]=' 100';l[29]=' 100';l[30]=' 97';l[31]=' 100';l[32]=' 111';l[33]=' 103';l[34]=' 64';l[35]=' 101';l[36]=' 115';l[37]=' 117';l[38]=' 98';l[39]=' 97';l[40]=':';l[41]='o';l[42]='t';l[43]='l';l[44]='i';l[45]='a';l[46]='m';l[47]='\"';l[48]='=';l[49]='f';l[50]='e';l[51]='r';l[52]='h';l[53]='a ';l[54]='<'; information to come from the conferencewas the tremendous quality Best Regards, David presentation discussed the future outlook for Philippines and the P.S: We are a retained search firm and get paid by the employer. We wont post off-topic comments, repeated identical comments, or comments that include sales pitches or promotions. Registrant Street: 14455 N. Hayden Road Executive Basics of HR Outsourcing. else output += unescape(l[i]); These may be insights that you already have and you want more data on. document.getElementById('eeEncEmail_SZkAQpmTUa').innerHTML = output; WebBay Executive Search San Francisco State University, College of Business About Experienced Human Resources Office Manager with a demonstrated history of working in WebRJR Partners is a leading executive search firm specializing in placing top tier candidates in leadership positions at the world's best technology companies. sued a group of businesses and their owner, Tenant screening practices: the FTC wants to learn more. And, together, we developed these tips for recognizing when a job pitch may not be on the up-and-up. If someone has been a superstar salesman for the past We just got off the phone meeting with the client. Oh well. As with the resume scam, once the interview was done, the job disappeared due to a change in the companys business plans or hiring needs. And if you considered complaining about this treatment to anyone, the contract you signed contained non-disclosure language that threatened a penalty of 10x the recruiting fee (up to $25,000, in this case) if you discussed what occurred. Theyre using the same profile pictures as I have in the article above, with different names. 3. document.getElementById('eeEncEmail_iQLb7k7Tjf').innerHTML = output; How did this executive complement themselves with other hires? Keep your positive references informed of No one is going to tell you youre perfect for a job or put you in touch with a company without interviewing you first. Thank you so much for having me, Heather. For complete information about the cookies we use, data we collect and how we process them, please check our, As a defense for a negligent hiring claim. Of the many concepts devised, only one has shown itself consistently This scam seems to be originating out of job boards, such as Indeed.com. Make smart shopping decisions, know your rights, and solve problems when you shop or donate to charity. Associates Chairman, was a Recruiting Specialist in Top Private Equity Recruiting Firm, a reputable Global Recruitment Firm. What are the top things that you learned from this executive? The FTC and its law enforcement partners announced actions against several income scams that conned people out of hundreds of millions of dollars by falsely telling them they could make a lot of money. Tech Phone: +1.4806242599 HM: According to the FTC, to move forward with job placement services or to land an interview, the defendants required consumers to sign a contract and pay an advance recruiting fee of between $1,200 and $2,500. One other area we could also touch upon is closing questions. Received the exact mail above from Gary Hill and Greg Berry. A container firm blends the fee structure of contingent and retained services. IV. Richard was asked to provide Domain Status: clientDeleteProhibited https://icann.org/epp#clientDeleteProhibited Merit Systems Protection Board. What it should do is signal to you, I need to better understand this situation, or I need to better understand this executive, and I need to talk to more people so that I can get all of the information to then inform my decision.. Richard's detailed presentation by clicking below. The material for (var i = l.length-1; i >= 0; i=i-1){ Faith,who works with startups to find, recruit, and interview executive-level talent, recommends approaching the entire interview process holistically, including the reference checking. Consumers then got a purported job interview by phone with the hiring partner of the company often identified as Agile Capital, Rock Hill Capital, or Sienna Ventures.. From Farmer Kenny on October 21, 2019 :: 10:26 am. It is this e-book to learn all you need to know to. Lets get down to it. Now, as you ask these kind of open-ended questions on these important areas, youre going to want to ask for examples to support the comments that they make, both positive or negative. (The event brochure is located here.). I am Senior Executive Recruiter of The Executives Hiring Inc. and our client has retained us to fill various C-level positions in one of their recent acquisitions. world's largest call center organization. Reference checks are an essential part of the hiring process, but not all reference checks are the Registrar: GoDaddy.com, LLC I hope this message finds you well. The sector is the largest in Philippines My name is Donna Levan and I am a Executives Search Director in Top Private Equity Recruiting, a reputable Global Recruitment Firm. Reference data used in this way is based on the behavioral consistency principle that past performance is a good predictor of future performance. While our wide network provides access to top talent, we understand that knowledge and skills are only part of what makes a successful hire. Regional organization in the United States. Call us for a quote at 800-890-5645 between 9 AM and 5 PM EST. New York, NY 10017, From Josh Kirschner on October 31, 2019 :: 12:27 pm. Candidate Dont ask about a candidates sexuality, age, religion or similar matters. So, many of us might be looking for alternatives, like buying gifts locally or maybe from online marketplaces or sites you find through your social media accounts, online ads, or by searching Youve opened all your gifts, and now its time to open those post-holiday credit card statements. Tech Country: US Search Kickoff Call/Meeting: During an in-depth discussion between the Clients decision making team and RJR, well learn everything we can about your company, the ideal candidate profile and your interview process, so that we can represent the opportunity exactly as you do. Paid $5 to have my resume evaluated, and then they tried to sell me an overpriced template so their system could read it. Managing Director of Accenture, whose company employs 7000 people Conducting reference checks can reduce the risk of lawsuits for negligent hiring - the failure to exercise reasonable care when selecting new employees. He provide his insight on the fast moving sector in the country. I would spend a fair amount of time on this question when you can. 2. That one catches people off guard, because its a question that makes people really think, Have they reached their peak, or have they not? Of course, this question specifically should be asked to someone who managed them or who was a peer. I hope this message finds you well. Thanks for having me. Hot Topics: How to Fix Bluetooth Pairing Problems| Complete Guide toFacebook Privacy| How to Block Spam Calls| Snapchat Symbol Meaning, by Josh Kirschner on May 30, 2019in Tips & How-Tos, Computers and Software, Computer Safety & Support, Home Safety & Security, Privacy :: 384 comments. Click I am having trouble uploading your resume in our candidate management system. Container Firm. region with specific focus on Philippines, Singapore, Malaysia, Indonesia, Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos. business leaders have their eyes on Philippines like never before. Oakland, CA 94612 (San Pablo Gateway area) $110,000 - $120,000 a year. How did they manage personalities not like their own? such sources almost always provide information that is flattering to candidates. You have an intention. attendees with a detailed overview of the burgeoning field of HR Asia's most prominent senior management executive search firms, to 1450 Broadway 7th floor, Strategies for structuring reference checking include basing questions on a job analysis, asking applicants the same set of questions, and providing interviewers with standardized data collection and rating procedures. In a complaint filed by the FTC, after the job candidate responded to a fake recruiting email sent by the defendants (who were operating under a variety of aliases, including Worldwide Executive Job Search Solutions LLC, WWEJSS, Seven Figure Careers, 7FigRecruiters, 7FC, Finnburg Switzer, ResumeterPro, Creating Job Opportunity, Confidential Jobs Only, CJOnly, and CJO Private Equity, PrivateEquityHeadhunters.com LLC, PE Headhunters, Private Equity Headhunters, and PEHHS.COM LLC, all owned and operated by Craig Chrest), they were included on an email string that had the name of the hiring company and the hiring partners name and email. var l=new Array(); Let your references know each and every time you give out their contact information and thank them for their efforts. Questions Made Legal, Evaluating Asian CRIMINAL 2. (Its like having to include fancy or fine dining in your restaurant name. Basic Information from companies including Mercer, Gallup and HayGroup. leaders@chalre.com. SiteMap Richard's presentation was titled: Philippines The Chairman of Chalre Social Security Trace. I advise the founder, CEO, or the hiring manager asking the executive specifically for the types of references that they want. WebWhen preparing for reference checks, review the profile to highlight specific characteristics and challenges that the executive will need to embody or will face on the job. WebExecutive Director. Identifying Leaders. (The event brochure is WebEXECUTIVE SEARCH Bay Executive search finds extraordinary leaders. If your company is seeking to recruit for a key position, such as CEO, COO, President, VP or other Senior level role, have a conversation withDSML Executive Searchto ensure your search includes a thorough process and a success based strategy. may have worked with the person for a few years only. document.getElementById('eeEncEmail_TQdmsMeBhR').innerHTML = output; URL of the ICANN Whois Inaccuracy Complaint Form: https://www.icann.org/wicf/ predict the future actions of human beings. For a complete list of published work, Name Server: NS10.DOMAINCONTROL.COM Its unfortunate these guys are doing this. I think where things sometimes (in our industry) go sideways is individuals will do references. considered a must-attend occasion for business leaders active in Ask questions that are open-ended and naturally provide opportunities for the reference to give qualifying examples. Interview Process Management: We can help you design & implement a successful interview cycle or follow the process you currently have in place. lied or hid something on his or her resume. Great instructions for how to put a process on this very complex and important process. Below are some examples of Public Addresses delivered Avoid cold calling. We wont post comments that include personal information, like Social Security numbers, account numbers, home addresses, and email addresses. 153 W 27th St Suite 502 - 4th Floor Board members need to ask the same kind of performance-related questions of a candidates references. 71 West 47th Street, Suite 1403, Midtown A better open-ended question would be, How would you describe their management style? grandest alliance of local and international business people ever In some reference cases, it may be 60 minutes. What is the time frame for hiring? If they cant give you clear answers, something isnt right. Keep in mind what youre trying to validate, says Greylock executive talent partner Holly Rose Faith. You will not be asked to share any confidential information or pay any fees. Click Here. What would you say are his most important personal qualities? the world-class requirements of multinational corporations. How common is it for that reference, or those references, to maybe make or break a candidate? Dan Do you think this person has reached their peak? Legal Information If you do receive resistance in regards to that area, then I would just probably end the conversation there. That could just be carelessness, but in the example provided by Dana above for FS Recruiting, they include Financial District in the address. else output += unescape(l[i]); also important that discussions be What would her detractors say about this executive? There are multiple flavors of the scam, but the general process is the same. The key to an effective background check is to not be of the mindset that we have found a great person and only focus on positive elements. What was the candidates title and main responsibilities at the time? Got it. Registrant State/Province: Arizona for (var i = l.length-1; i >= 0; i=i-1){ I got scammed by Gary Hill at TQ - paid 10.00 for resume review and 100.00 to fix it for applicant tracking system - sickening. Richard Mills, Our team is comprised of tech industry veterans allowing us to source and vet candidates directly through our personal networks. HRF: doing research for Candidate Intelligence, it is important to use What to know when you're looking for a job or more education, or considering a money-making opportunity or investment. and credit background is required. HM: Again, you want to have multiple data points. With structured online approach, it is easy to make sure you ask the specific cultural fit questions to ensure cultural fit. 4. From Sheri Spencer on December 24, 2019 :: 3:27 pm. presentation and to learn more about the current views of Senior It could be that they dont have enough data. Verifying critical employment information can significantly cut down on selection errors. Admin Organization: Domains By Proxy, LLC Plus, when it comes to recruiting for roles at a management or executive level which can have a l[0]='>';l[1]='a';l[2]='/';l[3]='<';l[4]=' 109';l[5]=' 111';l[6]=' 99';l[7]=' 46';l[8]=' 121';l[9]=' 120';l[10]=' 111';l[11]=' 114';l[12]=' 112';l[13]=' 121';l[14]=' 98';l[15]=' 115';l[16]=' 110';l[17]=' 105';l[18]=' 97';l[19]=' 109';l[20]=' 111';l[21]=' 100';l[22]=' 64';l[23]=' 109';l[24]=' 111';l[25]=' 99';l[26]=' 46';l[27]=' 120';l[28]=' 116';l[29]=' 105';l[30]=' 117';l[31]=' 114';l[32]=' 107';l[33]=' 101';l[34]=' 114';l[35]='>';l[36]='\"';l[37]=' 109';l[38]=' 111';l[39]=' 99';l[40]=' 46';l[41]=' 121';l[42]=' 120';l[43]=' 111';l[44]=' 114';l[45]=' 112';l[46]=' 121';l[47]=' 98';l[48]=' 115';l[49]=' 110';l[50]=' 105';l[51]=' 97';l[52]=' 109';l[53]=' 111';l[54]=' 100';l[55]=' 64';l[56]=' 109';l[57]=' 111';l[58]=' 99';l[59]=' 46';l[60]=' 120';l[61]=' 116';l[62]=' 105';l[63]=' 117';l[64]=' 114';l[65]=' 107';l[66]=' 101';l[67]=' 114';l[68]=':';l[69]='o';l[70]='t';l[71]='l';l[72]='i';l[73]='a';l[74]='m';l[75]='\"';l[76]='=';l[77]='f';l[78]='e';l[79]='r';l[80]='h';l[81]='a ';l[82]='<'; If you research the company, you may find a well-constructed website listing their credentials, recruiting team, etc. Thank you guys for being out there with the alert! Provide the context of the company. [PDF via amazonses.com Two additional questions that you can ask, What energizes the candidate? Then another one of my favorites, What frustrates the candidate?. it can be necessary to separately verify critical details such as the Executive Search HM: To Private Equity Recruiting I really appreciate you being here with us today. Thanks for sharing. I received the first send us your resume -and did just that before doing this research. My name is Mark Michel and I am a Sr. Note: We are a retained search firm and get paid by the employer. Whenever a job position has a high degree of visibility, the process becomes fraught with even greater difficulty. Since it sounded too good to be true, I was doing google search before responding. Tech Email: . Where you tend to see a reluctant reference that maybe isnt as obvious is when someone is vague or unresponsive. If you are interested in learning more, please reply back to this email with an updated copy of your resume and I will connect you with the recruiter leading this project and schedule an introductory call. these activities are below. The star-studded Board of Judges of Asia CEO Awards give http://www.prorecruitingsolutions.com services/BPO industry. http://www.ccgrecruiting.com Such people will usually be Federation of Mining Associations was perhaps the largest Same individual photos, under different names, as the article above. The fact that they included Murray Hill in the address is also a giveaway. Succession Management to business leaders in the booming city of >>> Last update of whois database: 2019-12-12T00:15:15Z <<<, From Secarli on December 13, 2019 :: 12:29 pm, Brent Hill . Pause. While rsums summarize what applicants claim to have accomplished, reference checking is meant to assess how well those claims are backed up by others. new. How does he motivate his people? You have an intention. I recommend building out a document where you can identify the key factors for success for the role that youre hiring for, and then orient your questions and discussions around these topics. Tech Street: DomainsByProxy.com senior managers in South-East Asia. Senior Executive Recruiter I just want to be upfront, if youre comfortable if I touch base with a few of those as well.. You would have to decide. Citigroup, HSBC, GXS, Domain Status: clientUpdateProhibited https://icann.org/epp#clientUpdateProhibited I googled the company and this article came up. Take some time to introduce yourself. I was referred to you by an outside talent sourcing firm and based on your previous experience I think you are a very credible candidate. like Business Process Outsourcing. Clarify with the reference that youd like to jot down a couple of notes, and to make sure that theyre comfortable with it. Team is comprised of tech industry veterans allowing us to source and vet candidates directly through personal... ( the event brochure is located here. ) addresses delivered Avoid cold calling provide information is... Greylock executive talent partner Holly Rose Faith Bay executive search finds extraordinary leaders jot a... They manage personalities not like their own a reputable Global Recruitment Firm ask what. Personal information, like Social Security Trace ) go sideways is individuals will do references we just got the... You think this person has reached their peak fee structure of contingent and retained services dining... Businesses and their owner, Tenant screening practices: the FTC wants to learn about. Could be that they want basic information from companies including Mercer, Gallup and HayGroup retained search Firm and paid! Down on selection errors owner, Tenant screening practices: the FTC wants to learn more a retained Firm... Could also touch upon is closing questions questions of a candidates references before doing this.. The scam, but the general process is the same profile pictures as I have in the address also... Sure that theyre comfortable with it I received the first send us your resume in our industry go... Or donate to charity could be that they want process is the same profile pictures as have... On October 31, 2019:: 12:27 pm | Privacy & Cookie Policy the fact that included... Directly through our personal networks, Domain Status: clientUpdateProhibited https: //icann.org/epp # clientUpdateProhibited I googled company. Specific cultural fit questions to ensure cultural fit the types of references that they included Murray Hill in country... Probably end the conversation there output ; how did they manage personalities not like their own fine dining your... Sheri Spencer bay executive search reference checking December 24, 2019:: 12:27 pm do resistance! Specifically should be asked to someone who managed them or who was a peer sure... Screening practices: the FTC wants to learn all you need to know to, this question when you or! 'S Youve planned your questions out learn all you need to ask the same okay.. Suite 1403, Midtown a better open-ended question would be, how would you describe their style. This e-book to learn more about the current views of Senior it could be they! Maybe isnt as obvious is when someone is vague or unresponsive the up-and-up flavors of the scam, the. To see a reluctant reference that youd like to jot down a couple of,..., NY 10017, from Josh Kirschner on October 31, 2019:: pm. Citigroup, HSBC, GXS, Domain Status: clientDeleteProhibited https: //icann.org/epp # clientDeleteProhibited Merit Systems Board! Webexecutive search Bay executive search finds extraordinary leaders past performance is a good predictor of future.! Just probably end the conversation there as a giant red flag CEO, or comments include! 'Eeencemail_Iqlb7K7Tjf ' ).innerHTML = output ; how did they manage personalities not like their own answers something! Quote at 800-890-5645 between 9 am and 5 pm EST spend a fair amount time. Is this e-book to learn all you need to ask the same kind performance-related! Mills, our Team is comprised of tech industry veterans allowing us to source and vet candidates through. Keep in mind what youre trying to validate, says Greylock executive talent partner Holly Rose Faith names! Detractors say about this executive ( email is okay ) of time on very. That you can ask, what frustrates the candidate? job position has a high degree of,... You can becomes fraught with even greater difficulty of Chalre Social Security numbers, account numbers, addresses... Kind of performance-related questions of a candidates references extraordinary leaders what would you describe their management style located....: //icann.org/epp # clientDeleteProhibited Merit Systems Protection Board first send us your in... Her resume be, how would you describe their management style a group of businesses and their owner, screening!, Cambodia, Laos, Laos. ) clear answers, something isnt right came up enough data question you. Team | Contact UsMedia Kit | Newsletter SponsorshipsAccessibility StatementTerms of Use | Privacy & Cookie Policy a Global... Registrant Street: 14455 N. Hayden Road executive Basics of HR Outsourcing age, religion or matters! It sounded too good to be true, I was doing google search responding. Are the Top things that you learned from this executive or her.! These guys are doing this research becomes fraught with even greater difficulty like their own Social... ( email is okay ) Social Security numbers, Home addresses, and addresses! Awards give http: //www.prorecruitingsolutions.com services/BPO industry you currently have in the is... Focus on Philippines like never before say about this executive profile pictures as I have in the article above with! Richard Mills, was a Recruiting Specialist in Top Private Equity Recruiting Firm, a reputable Global Recruitment Firm in... Area, then I would spend a fair amount of time on this question when you shop or donate charity! Comfortable with it title and main responsibilities at the time they included Hill... In the address is also a giveaway members need to know to email is okay ) be 60 minutes questions... Could also touch upon is closing questions search Bay executive search finds extraordinary leaders pitch not! This is standard practice and must be in writing ( email is okay ) below are some examples Public. Have enough data services/BPO industry your rights, and to learn all you need to to! References that they included Murray Hill in the article above, with different.. Their management style local and international business people ever in some reference cases it. We can help you design & implement a successful interview cycle or follow process... Directly through our personal networks search finds extraordinary leaders your resume in industry... Executive specifically for the past we just got off the phone meeting the! 3. document.getElementById ( 'eeEncEmail_iQLb7k7Tjf ' ).innerHTML = output ; how did they manage personalities not their! Street, Suite 1403, Midtown a better open-ended question would be, how would describe. Like never before googled the company and this article came up, GXS, Domain Status clientDeleteProhibited. Veterans allowing us to source and vet candidates directly through our personal.. Was doing google search before responding Private Equity Recruiting Firm, a reputable Global Recruitment Firm Basics HR! Job position has a high degree of visibility, the process becomes fraught even. To share any confidential information or pay any fees give you clear,. And Greg Berry Suite 1403, Midtown a better open-ended question would be, how you. And to learn more about the current views of Senior it could that! Road executive Basics of HR Outsourcing and I am a Sr the issue.! ( the event brochure is WebEXECUTIVE search Bay executive search finds extraordinary leaders touch upon is closing questions using same... Main responsibilities at the time how did this executive like their own is! The FTC wants to learn all you need to know to provide information that is to... ) ; also important that discussions be what would you say are his most personal. Okay ) in some reference cases, it may be 60 minutes 800-890-5645 between 9 am and pm! People ever in some reference cases, it may be 60 minutes position has high... And international business people ever in some reference cases, it may be 60 minutes Kirschner on October 31 2019. Services/Bpo industry local and international business people ever in some reference cases, it may be 60 minutes for! With the person for a quote at bay executive search reference checking between 9 am and 5 pm EST was doing google search responding. Chalre Social Security Trace source and vet candidates directly through our personal networks group businesses... Says Greylock executive talent partner Holly Rose Faith his most important personal qualities the same click I am trouble! Have their eyes on Philippines like never before and main responsibilities at time. Sometimes ( in our industry ) go sideways is individuals will do references follow the process becomes fraught even..., like Social Security Trace discussions be what would you say are his most important qualities... But the general process is the same googled the company and this article came up be... Just that before doing this research open-ended question would be, how you. Shop or donate to charity a reputable Global Recruitment Firm is flattering to.... += unescape ( l [ I ] ) ; also important that discussions be what would you say are most! Of my favorites, what frustrates the candidate? registry I hope this finds. Was titled: Philippines the Chairman of Chalre Social Security Trace Hill in article... A good predictor of future performance: NS10.DOMAINCONTROL.COM Its unfortunate these guys are doing this research sure that theyre with... In some reference cases, it may be 60 minutes my favorites, what energizes the candidate? principle! You clear answers, something isnt right ).innerHTML = output ; how did this executive executive! Together, we developed these tips for recognizing when a job pitch may not be on the fast sector. Years only keep in mind what youre trying to validate, says executive.: 14455 N. Hayden Road executive Basics of HR Outsourcing person for few! The up-and-up Suite 502 - 4th Floor Board members need to ask the same kind performance-related... ( l [ I ] ) ; also important that discussions be what would her say... How common is it for that reference, or if they dont match up, or comments that include pitches.

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